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Phil
United States
Albuquerque
New Mexico
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Why FantasyCraft?
After having run the Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay 3rd Edition (WFRP3E) adventure The Gathering Storm for a group of friends, and finding some little nits with the ruleset, I’ve decided to run an adventure in the same setting (The Reikland - Warhammer) using the FantasyCraft ruleset for a different set of friends. WFRP3E is a decent system, but I found myself wanting a few areas fleshed out a little more. I may keep using WFRP3E with my first group, or switch to FantasyCraft, not sure yet.
Without going into lots of detail in a non-WFRP thread, there were two areas in which WFRP3E diverged from my tastes: social conflict and tactical combat. I’m in the camp of people who feel that, in an effort to streamline WFRP tactical combat, the net result was somewhat tricky to use in practice. I had difficulty keeping ranges and distances straight, and the overall abstract movement system was cumbersome. It may have been better to just use a purely narrative system and forego miniatures altogether. Although, personally, I like miniatures for tactical combat, which partly prompted looking at other rulesets.
The other area, social conflict, didn’t seem very fleshed out. There were a handful of cards to use in social situations, but not much in terms of guidance on how. For instance, you can use a manuever during an encounter turn, which could be a skill. So, could a player use a social skill and a social card (which relies on a social skill) in the same turn? The GM’s guide also mentioned using a tracker during a social encounter, where each side moves the tracker on their turn, trying to convince the other side of their point. But, there wasn’t much guidance on how long this tracker should be, what sorts of actions move it, how players should interact, etc. I tried some ideas, but never found anything I felt satisfied with.
Looking around at other fantasy games to try, the two front-runners were Burning Wheel and FantasyCraft. They both have merits. Burning Wheel has great narrative subsystems, but doesn’t cater to tactical combat or miniatures. FantasyCraft isn’t as good for social conflicts, but is built off of d20, and does a decent job of pushing that system in interesting directions, while supporting a tactical miniatures core from D&D3E with some additional streamlining. Ultimately, I decided on FantasyCraft. Part of this was motivated by the fact that the group I’m running it for has played D&D3E for many years, so the transition should be fairly smooth. While FantasyCraft has many differences, there are some core similarities there.
Creating characters.
Session 0 was spent rolling up characters. Usually I like to just hand out pre-gens or have players make characters on their own, so we can start playing sooner. But FantasyCraft has so many options, that we decided a character to generation session would be nice. The characters include the following:
Maximus (Human/Grizzled, Male, Class: Soldier, Specialty: Gladiator) - An ex-member of a travelling circus. Worked to entertain crowds by essentially working in local toughman contests, taking on all comers as a vicious brawler, as well as showman in fixed fights. Now retired, and looking for work in Ubersreik.
Celeste Abriout (Human/Charismatic, Class: Courtier, Specialty: Aristocrat) - A Bretonnian heiress, Celeste is the WFRP equivalent of a debutante. Full of charm and elegance, but not so much experience.
Boris Muller (Human/Vigilant, Class: Scout, Specialty: Warden) - Boris was emplyed as a messanger for the von Saponatheim family from Bogenhafen. He is intimately familiar with the many highways and byways of the Reikland.
Ulfar Garrison (Human, Class: Sage) - Ulfar is Celeste’s retainer, helping provide her with some context and knowledge while she’s in Ubersreik.
Character creation in FantasyCraft took a decent amount of time. There are many options, and it took us a while to wrap our heads around some of them, but there are certainly some neat ideas.
After constructing characters, I mentioned some rumors in the area, roughly corresponding to the plotlines in the WFRP3E adventures The Edge of Night, The Gathering Strom, and An Eye for an Eye. The players were fairly open to ideas, but were leaning towards starting in Ubersreik. I will probably start them with An Eye for an Eye, the WFRP3E intro adventure, with the hook being Celeste’s desire to ingratiate herself with a local nobleman.
Since I’m running adventures in a different system, there is going to be some conversion work. Constructing adversaries (Beastmen!) and NPCs in FantasyCraft is very easy, almost surprisingly so. All the standard features you would want in a monster or encounter are there, and it is possible to construct them in mere minutes. This aspect doesn’t concern me much and I don’t think I’ll have much trouble doing it.
Investigative games, socially persuasive characters, and FantasyCraft.
Warning: contains some spoilers for the WFRP3E adventure An Eye for an Eye, included in the core set.
However, after reading over the FantasyCraft book in more detail, I do have some concerns about the upcoming adventure (An Eye for an Eye). This involves the use of the Impress skill to influence and persuade an NPC. All NPCs in FantasyCraft have a Disposition score, which roughly reflects how they feel about a particular character (it feeds into an Attitude, which is a general sentiment, while Disposition is a numeric value). One way to adjust a Disposition is to use the Impress skill opposed by the target’s Resolve. Celeste, the Courtier, has a very high Impress skill already and will probably be able to adjust the Disposition of most NPCs without too much trouble. This could be problematic in an investigative scenario like Eye for an Eye where the goal is to figure out which members of the noble’s retinue are in league with chaos. What happens if the villains become friendly with the heroes?
For some types of social checks, it is possible for the GM to spend action dice to effectively ignore the result. Extending this to Impress checks, I could use action dice judiciously to avoid having NPCs move up the Disposition tree. The other way this is somewhat tempered is that an NPC can only have their Attitude adjusted once per scene, where a scene is a fairly long period of time (most adventures consisting of 3-5 scenes total). Thus, it is also a slow process. Finally, it is also possible for NPCs to adjust the Disposition of other NPCs. So, if Celeste starts charming the cook, who is in league with Chaos, the head of staff (the leader of the cult) may attempt to lower Celeste’s disposition by using his own Impress skill.
All that said, I also don’t want to stomp all over what makes this character cool. Charming people is her main schtick, so it should get used. Particularly important for her character development, I think, is becoming close with the head noble who hired them (Rickard Aschaffenberg).
On the other hand, instead of trying to use mechanical techniques (like action dice) to thwart social successes with the villains, it may be interesting to allow them to become impressed. Having a fanatic cultist become friendly with Celeste is all fine and good initially, until that time when he reveals his sudden love for her with a horrific gift like a human sacrifice, or perhaps an invitation (demand) to join him ringside while the demon arrives. There may be some fun dramatic moments in there somewhere. I’m really not sure how any of this will play out.
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Charles Donnell
United States
Houston
Texas
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I really enjoyed this session report and hope to see more like it as the game progresses.
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Phil
United States
Albuquerque
New Mexico
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Chaz Donnell wrote: I really enjoyed this session report and hope to see more like it as the game progresses.
Thanks! I'll try to oblige!
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wayne r
United States
Pennsylvania
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I think an element of roleplay is necessary in an investigative scene. The player's use of a particular skill should make sense (determine what kind of angle she is using and see if it is appropriate/relevent to this particualar scene). In other words, you shouldn't rely on the mechanics by itself.
FYI, you can't use action dice to totally erase what the PC rolled. At best (mechanically speaking), you can spend an action die to boost a roll by d6 or if special character, you roll using a die higher than the highest action die of a PC (in this case when doing an opposed roll).
You do have power in how you interpret her success so you can bring an interesting twist as a result of her success. Just because she used her success to shift the npc's disposition favorbly to her doesn't mean it erases his nature. If she used her sex appeal, he could have given them the information they seek but warn his fellow conspirators asking them that they only keep her alive. If she used a bribe, he could still backstab them...
Anyway, I'm glad to see a session using FC. I look forward to reading more.
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Phil
United States
Albuquerque
New Mexico
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oninowon wrote: I think an element of roleplay is necessary in an investigative scene. The player's use of a particular skill should make sense (determine what kind of angle she is using and see if it is appropriate/relevent to this particualar scene). In other words, you shouldn't rely on the mechanics by itself.
FYI, you can't use action dice to totally erase what the PC rolled. At best (mechanically speaking), you can spend an action die to boost a roll by d6 or if special character, you roll using a die higher than the highest action die of a PC (in this case when doing an opposed roll).
You do have power in how you interpret her success so you can bring an interesting twist as a result of her success. Just because she used her success to shift the npc's disposition favorbly to her doesn't mean it erases his nature. If she used her sex appeal, he could have given them the information they seek but warn his fellow conspirators asking them that they only keep her alive. If she used a bribe, he could still backstab them...
Anyway, I'm glad to see a session using FC. I look forward to reading more.
Good points, thanks! I really like your comments about using Disposition. It uses the system to create some interesting roleplay opportunities.
I believe, though, that in the specific case of Impress skill checks used for persuasion, you can essentially erase what the PC rolled.
FantasyCraft wrote: A player character or villain may spend 1 action die to ignore a successful Persuade check targeting them.
My comments were mostly about expanding this idea to apply to any social rolls, although I'm mostly thinking about Influence checks. I might be prematurely addressing a non-existent problem, though.
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wayne r
United States
Pennsylvania
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What Campaign Qualities have you implemented?
I was a little disappointed that all PCs being human (unless you are running a human-centric campaign). It would have been interesting to see other races...
Did you have a difficult time translating the flow of the adventure? I ask because there is some gripe about how FC uses scenes as a basis of building an adventure and a lot of abilities are explained from that perspective.
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Phil
United States
Albuquerque
New Mexico
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oninowon wrote: What Campaign Qualities have you implemented?
I was a little disappointed that all PCs being human (unless you are running a human-centric campaign). It would have been interesting to see other races...
Did you have a difficult time translating the flow of the adventure? I ask because there is some gripe about how FC uses scenes as a basis of building an adventure and a lot of abilities are explained from that perspective.
I implemented spells and miracles, although none of the players chose to go down those roads. Sort of surprising, actually. I was also thinking of using some action dice to make magic a little wild, but it seems like I won't have to worry about it. Doesn't look like there will be much magic.
As far as human-centric, while I didn't forbid certain other races, the WFRP setting as a whole is pretty human-centric. There are a few iconic counterexamples (like Dwarf Troll-Slayers), but most of the action would be in human settlements, and they frequently look down on other races.
As far as translating the flow, that's a good question. WFRP already has somewhat similar structures on top of the narrative. In WFRP3E there are Chapters and Encounters and Acts. In this particular adventure, the Chapter breakdown seemed to correspond pretty well to an FC Scene, so I just did that. There are three Scenes in the adventure (getting to the lodge, interviewing the residents, the forces of chaos attack), which is within the bounds they recommend for FC (3-5 Scenes per adventure I think, don't have the book with me).
Something like a DungeonCrawl seems more difficult to translate to a Scene structure, but none of the WFRP source material I'm adapting really has that flavor. Most of the WFRP3E adventures are a little more investigative, so it's easier to think of them in terms of Scenes.
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wayne r
United States
Pennsylvania
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What about Menace and Threat Level?
I'm surprised you are using very little Campaign Quality especially since WHFR is supposed to be dark and gritty (from what I heard-don't know much about the setting).
The default FC game is heroic so doesn't that take away the feel of WHFR?
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Phil
United States
Albuquerque
New Mexico
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oninowon wrote: What about Menace and Threat Level?
I'm surprised you are using very little Campaign Quality especially since WHFR is supposed to be dark and gritty (from what I heard-don't know much about the setting).
The default FC game is heroic so doesn't that take away the feel of WHFR?
For this first adventure, I set the Menace at II, so there is no change to Threat Level.
I recall looking at the Campaign Qualities, but I don't think any of the permanent qualities really fit. Some of the temporary ones might work, but I can add those in later.
I think WFRP is certainly a lower magic world than some of the D&D settings. So, that was my concern over anything else, but not having any spellcasters, I sort of dodged it. Divination magic, in particular, really isn't appropriate in a campaign that features lots of investigation.
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wayne r
United States
Pennsylvania
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Remember that many of the Campaign Qualities can be used as a permanent or temporary effect. What's stated in the book are only guidelines. Just because a Campaign Quality says "temporary" doesn't mean you can't use it as a permanent effect.
I don't know the play style of WHFR 3rd ed but you should look over these CQ. I'm going by what I've heard of 2nd ed:
- Bleak Heroes
- Deadly Combat
- Fragile Heroes
- Hewn Limbs
Bleak Heroes is good because it definately changes the tone of the game play. The default FC is a heroic style play but by decreasing # of Action Dice, you come closer to the feel of WHFR.
The next three definately make combat deadlier. I wouldn't put all 3 in there but maybe 1 or 2 would definately make it feel closer to the setting. Personally, if WHFR is anything like Dark Heresy, I would definately do Bleak Heroes, Fragile Heroes, and either Deadly Combat or Hewn Limbs (both would be overkill IMO).
I'm used to SpyCraft so the use of Action Dice on some of the staple CQs seem not to make sense to me (such as Bleak Heroes). I just see them as permanent and others that are permanent seem to make more sense as temporary (such as Dramatic Pacing which kind of reminds me of Max Payne style scenario).
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